Wednesday, April 11, 2012

Fairewinds' Gundersen: "Reactor 3's Spent Fuel Pool Worse Off"

ENENEWS has the link to the podcast, for those who are interested.



Anonymous said...

enews is imflamatory at best and you have to double and triple check every thing that is posted there .I find that they have a little bit of truth and alot of speculation

Anonymous said...

ENENEWS is infinitely better than Fukushima Diary, as ENENEWS actually corrects mistakes.

In this case, they are simply linking to a radio program where Gundersen appeared.

Anonymous said...

The first step to getting this problem solved is for the Japan government to take over from TEPCO. TEPCO is still making decisions based on "cost effectiveness" and we all know TEPCO didn't like spending money even before they became virtually bankrupt. Government needs to push them aside and start spending obscene money like only a government can.

Governments around the world need to push Japan government in this course.

Please do it now. Big quake could come very soon. TEPCO should not be involved in the spending decisions.

Anonymous said...

Thanks Laprimavera, good to see something here from ENENEWS.

On the sites that I frequent, it is generally agreed that ENENEWS has proven to be a very valuable resource over the course of the past year. They gather information from far and wide, they present diverse aspects of the Fukushima nuclear crisis from numerous sources, they update with unparalleled frequency, and they're usually the first to post a breaking story.

Given the speed and sheer volume of information, there is bound to be an occasional story that doesn't stand the test of time. Yes, their headlines can sometimes be a bit hyperbolic. Any responsible reader will click through to the original texts and find that, on the whole, the sources are legitimate and credible and known in the public domain.

Let's not forget that there are plenty of established and venerable news entities that have been entirely wrong about matters of life and death on a global scale.

So, let's not go all medieval on ENENEWS for their imperfections.


Anonymous said...

Can't thank all you guys enough for covering this disaster.

Keep asking questions.

Keep thinking outside the square.

Anonymous said...

@ JP

Saying "enews is imflamatory at best" is not going 'medieval' on that website. I didn't write the previous post but I have also found that enews reports as fact information that is sometimes too raw and proves false.

Anonymous said...

JP, ya think responsible readers go to enenews and click through to the original texts written by Fukushima Diary?

Majia's Blog said...

Troll Alert!

Anonymous said...

Who's troll? Gundersen?

Anonymous said...

These sites bring the information on certain subjects together. It is up to us to sift through and evaluate.

I find they have less misinformation than the Tepco site. Or NRC.......or...

Anonymous said...

Hardly anyone is interested in sifting through.

Anonymous said...

Well I remember even the people who come to this blog were upset when the site admin scrutinized Gundersen's method. There was even someone who said the admin was doing "Gotcha journalism" when he pointed out the error in the much-admired ambassador's letter.

No one's interested in details. Who are you kidding?

Anonymous said...

"enews is imflamatory at best and you have to double and triple check every thing that is posted there .I find that they have a little bit of truth and alot of speculation"

1) No link(s) to support your claim
2) The site is enenews
3) It's spelled 'inflammatory'

Anonymous said...

Oh boy. Spell-police is here.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous #2 claims "I didn't write the previous post but I have also found that enews reports as fact information that is sometimes too raw"

You didn't write the original comment, yet you are the only other person to spell enenews as enews? OK... your different people. Right.

Perhaps your minds just think alike, and that's why you are unable to properly comprehend the sourced information there.

Faberd said...

Anonymous said...
Who's troll? Gundersen?
April 11, 2012 6:40 PM


attacking enenews and calling Gundersen a troll. Time to head back to nei.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous at APRIL 11, 2012 7:17 PM,

said "Hardly anyone is interested in sifting through."

I guess that means you can't evaluate either?

arevamirpal::laprimavera said...

So a troll is the one who attacks enenews and Gundersen?

Here I was, thinking that a troll is a Finnish Jesuit extolling the virtue of King James Bible (or something like that).

Anonymous said...

Anon @ 7:41pm.

I am the second poster. I cut and pasted some text and grabbed the first identical mispelling there and then I mispelled enews...c'mon I make THAT mistake every time I go to the takes me a few tries and so I didn't catch the first poster's typo there either.
I DO go to enenews but I do have to sift through documents there. I will say that they have improved in this regard (much more sifting back when Fuku threw up last year). I do read enenews and I post alot re Fukushima on other websites and point readers to
I am grateful to ALL those who shed light on Fuku but I have to evaluate what I read (yeah I know how to do that - biologist and editor by former trade) on these sites - they are all worth my time (IMHO). But - you know you can just insinuate that I am the same as the first poster or that I am a troll if I don't stay in lockstep with you on all opinions and you'll never have to prove it. Easy for you, isn't it?

Anonymous said...

You have to love sifting through to find that gem. But yep, there are days.
And "Troll" accusations are a bit yesterday. Lazy way to shut down arguments.
But these guys are allowing the debate, and flow of information, to continue where it has been dropped by mainstream journalists.

Anonymous said...

There are reasons for concealing identity, some/most perfectly valid.

But there are also mechanisms for creating an identity for the purpose of posting, and it is easier to track viewpoints and to respond appropriately if each poster acquires an identity.

I would urge any lurkers, when giving in to the temptation to engage- maybe for the second time- to go off to WordPress, OpenID, Google, AIM, etc., and get oneself an account.

A profusion of Anons can be confusing, and if your point of view is important to you then confusion is an impediment.

Hope that Helps.

On another issue in the above commentary, Spelling Police is a good tool, in combination, to detect (a) mischief makers, (b) machine gun shills, and (c) new arrivals. Each of these however needs its own class of response.

I use the term "machine gun shill" to identify the paid or unpaid nuclear hacks who are under pressure of time and do not compose properly... these are commonly found on MSM websites.



elbows said...

I've already ranted about poor info and hysteria so I won't repeat that here.

So looking at the podcast specifically, I think its fine so long as you listen to the whole thing and don't just focus on the scariest sentences. For example I was pleased that Gundersen mentioned that they had built a supporting structure under reactor 4 pool, rather than mentioning only the negative stuff.

I was a bit confused when he mentioned the 3 options for getting the fuel out of reactor 4 pool. The first possibility he mentioned involved using the existing trolley, but as we have seen from photos in recent months they have already removed the refuelling bridge from the building, which makes me wonder if Gundersen is unaware of this.

elbows said...

Ha now I am laughing about how bad the 'Fukushima diary' site is.

3 examples of utter stupidity in recent days:

He thinks they are injecting liquid nitrogen (as opposed to just nitrogen) into the reactors.

The suspension of reactor 4 pool cooling due to a leak in the system leads to complete overreaction 'prepare to evacuate Tokyo'

And my favourite, which makes me laugh very loudly, is the snow melting on Mt. Fuji - Mt Fuji is heated! lol.

I feel bad for people that give money to this idiot. Make no mistake, providing information can be of great service to the public, but the real value is added by decent filtering and analysis of information.

Anonymous said...

I wrote the original post. Thanks for the spell check. I've noticed that spelling usually gets in the way when someone disagrees with you. I made the post because enenews seems more about grabbing your attention by trying to sound scary. I have no link to my opinion. I am only posting as anonymous because of a very long story involving my teenage son and other accounts. A very small example of why I feel this way about enenews is ,storage pool 3 and 4 are not any worse off than a week ago ,a month ago , and almost a year ago. This is all based on a worse case scenario report. These things can still happen for a number of reasons. They haven't and if you are not careful about enenews you could believe something is eminent. In a time when people are already very afraid that is just irresponsible.

Anonymous said...

The need to denigrate bloggers personally for inaccurate filtering or analysis of information seems petty at times. In regard to F. Diary, what I see is a young man whose human fight/flight response to the disaster was flight. He was not unique in this. He has provided information in an emotional and unfiltered way. Take what you want from this. Industry professionals have not been accurate in all their analyses either. Those of us, prior to 3/11, who had limited knowledge on the short and long term effects of 3 nuclear reactors melting down, have searched, posted, commented, blogged, protested, and attempted to understand this epic clusterf*ck.
Thank you again for this effort on your part. This site provides both valuable information and a place for open discussion. While we may not agree on all subjects, the fact that many are here talking together about it is very important.
Again, thank you, and my apologies if this is too OT.

sue4e3 said...

feeling better now that I have an account .To anonymous 4/12/12 8:14 I don't think you were over the top at all. I agree with you.

Anonymous said...

>The need to denigrate bloggers personally for inaccurate filtering or analysis of information seems petty at times.

Utter ignorance after more than one year of "providing" "information" is as bad as the lying TEPCO or Japanese government.

Anonymous said...

Okay, troll b-tch, naysayer...why are you obsessively posting about how bad these blogs are and yet...still reading them?

You see a "non-troll" would not bother...BUSTED.

Anonymous said...

@anon at 10:55am, many of us do not have choice but having to read these fantastic (in a literal sense) blogs because some upset friend sends me a post and is freaked out that the world is ending.

Only people like you don't bother because you're set in your mind about the accident, whatever it is. You should not bother to come here either.

Anonymous said...

@elbows, that kind of information gets translated back into Japanese and spreads as legit reporting by the "foreign media". I've seen it too often over the past year. It goes round and round...

sue4e3 said...

I was the original poster if anyone didn't get that. I was coming here because it wasn't fantastic it was just the facts and opinions of someone concerned. I do not think the people involved in enenews and some other blog sights are concerned as much as they are araid or grabbing attention. I believe those that are afraid are hoping for a form of "debunking" or comfort so that they do not have to be as afraid , and some of those are looking to find hope in talking and doing. I find the attention grabbers are not forced to the areas. They can leave or have the money to eat outside of the country .They do not have to deal with the fear they inflict. If my opinion(being different from yours ) makes me a troll so be it .

Anonymous said...

To the fool posting at 10:55am April 12.

I am the second poster, sue4e3 is the original poster - the person you are ranting at for being a troll (10:34) did not write either of our posts - so there is a 3rd 'anon' person with the opinion that one must filter what one reads. So you haven't detected a pattern of behavior - you are just raving at 3 different people. I will take the good advice upthread to get an ID to cut down on the overall number of anon's here...and then you'll have fewer excuses to rave.

Anonymous said...

Soooo many paid off b-tches complaining about a news site that they *don't have to visit*. Who hired you? Stratfor??? LMAO.

Energy news offers an unparalleled wealth of information--as does EX-SKF. If you find their news sensational or disturbing, you probably have not learned the lesson of Fukushima ... that governments allowing companies to destroy entire land masses and lives IS disturbing.

So far energy news and EX-SKF have not been far from the mark...mainstream media, lying government officials and TEPCO cheerleaders--they have been f-ck all wrong, at every twist and turn.

Therefore...I'm on "team blogs"!!!

P.S. We know you are trolls, because you obsessively keep checking back and trying to get the last word, here. Get over your criticisms and stop reading this site, already...and then get a REAL JOB!!!

arevamirpal::laprimavera said...

People are free to post criticism here. Also, it's about time to stop calling people whom you don't agree with "trolls".

Anonymous said...

Misitu said "go off to WordPress, OpenID, Google, AIM, etc., and get oneself an account."

Have you thought, an account at these locations may be a good way of disclosing who you are? If you are worried about "unpaid nuclear hacks" I would advise you to post as Anonymous.

Anonymous said...

Please use the word "troll" responsibly. ;-)

Actually, there has been surprisingly very little real trolling in these comment sections. The Finnish Anti-Jesuit Arto-Lauri-loving Die-Die-Die dude was more of a paranoid nutcase than a troll and Karen Sherry Brackett always has the grammar and spelling nazi after her in retaliation for her being such an arrogant half-wit. So, no one is really trolling yet in the strictest sense.

elbows said...

I agree there hasn't been much real trolling.

It does sadden me that attempts to discuss detail and provide balance cause some people to rant in a paranoid way about people being 'paid by TEPCO etc', but I suppose this is inevitable. I have no desire to repeatedly stir up useless debate on this subject, so I will try hard not to rant too often in the comments section of this site about some of the scaremongering fools and bad info on other sites. People can believe whatever they like at the end of the day, and I am not pro-nuclear so I don't care too much if people get the wrong impression.

What disturbs me more is that so few people who have detailed first-hand experience of nuclear power stations etc have been prepared to speak openly and at length on the internet about many of the small technical aspects of equipment & systems at Mark 1 BWR plants. Scientific papers and non-experts slowly working out the details has been the alternative, and this works ok but it would be better for humanity if people that already understood the details had been prepared to say more. Secrecy is seldom good and the Japanese government made trust & information worse by not being completely open in the first months of the disaster.

This is a continued problem with public communications during times of emergency, there is always a huge contradiction. On the one hand the experts recognise that timely and useful information is necessary to give the public some trust in the authorities, but this nearly always loses out to fears about public panic, economic damage etc. Fukushima is a very good example of this, and the results are messy and undesirable.

Anonymous said...

Just my 2p, but it's good to distinguish between Trolls and Shills.

Another 1p says that we can all get angry and lose the plot occasionally, which is an unnecessary diversion, and the only answer to this is for folks to have been around long enough to have a handle on where individual posters are coming from.

The 0p remains in that Anon is difficult to have a conversation with, and at some point to refuse to be identified even with a pseudonym does lose you points - and can cause unnecessary confusion, as in this thread.


Anonymous said...

I'm keeping up. Taking points on merit rather than who they came from suits me.

Great blog.

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